Max ZT & Dan Whitehouse will be embarking on a UK tour in November 2021 and seeing as this is the first time they have met, I thought it would be a great idea to learn more about how they came to record together in the first place. We also chatted about their musical upbringings, influences, their likes (and dislikes) of touring and which bands or artists are currently floating their boats….
Gentlemen, you both met and collaborated online as part of the Global Music Match programme in May 2021, please tell me how you both got involved with this and what it was like working together for the first time?
Dan - In Spring 2021, I submitted an online application to English Folk Expo and was delighted to be chosen to represent England within the program (GMM). I had to submit my music, online stats and talk about my art making process. Max and I enjoyed a positive connection from our first phone call, just as mates at first and then as collaborators when he over heard the sun worshippers at Tokyo Bay…this group of local people who met every morning to sing ancient Japanese songs to the sun….Max was able to identify the scale (Insen) and wrote a piece of music that became our first collaboration: Shizuka しずか
Dan - We come from different musical backgrounds/ disciplines but shared a lot straight off the bat in terms of life as a working musician, and during that first call we had a laugh sharing stories about funny things that happen at gigs and the perils of life on the road. We were still in lock down back then and we talked about how much we had enjoyed the opportunity to take life at a slower pace and focus on some elements that often get ignored during the hectic nature of touring life. For me that meant exploring writing poetry, music theory practice, yoga, and catching up on ten years of lost sleep!
Max - As someone who has spent most of their adult life traveling and connecting with people from around the world, the early stages of the pandemic were quite tricky. The GMM program offered that connection to likeminded artists from around the world, and I’m grateful to have met so many wonderful musicians. From the very beginning working with Dan was a beautiful experience. We connected quickly, and although we discussed music regularly, much of our conversation landed at a deeper philosophical place.
I guess that distance wasn’t an issue as this was the primary reason that you actually met in the first place, how did it feel to finally meet and rehearse/practice together whilst in the same room?
Dan - We have written and recorded four pieces together remotely. Each time Max began the process by improvising on the Hammer Dulcimer, send me files and I wrote topline and spoken word, Max then edited, we invited Gustaf Ljunggren (Copenhagen) and Ösp Eldjárn (Iceland) to add overdubs and then Max mixed the work
Max - We actually haven’t met yet! It feels funny to say….
Max ZT has been described as the "Hendrix of hammered dulcimer” – Please tell me a bit more about the hammered dulcimer and how you came to be such a great player of it?
Max - The hammered dulcimer is the American/Western European version of the Persian “santur.” There are about 20 versions of the instrument stretching from Iran to India to China to Hungary to Germany to the UK to the States. It’s a very old instrument (though debatable - some say its around 4000 years old), and it is referenced in the Bible. The instrument is a trapezoid and is basically a manual, deconstructed, de-mechanized piano. I’ve been building the instruments with the great builder David Lindsey since 2007, and it’s been a dream to get to know the instrument from that side.
I want to take things right back to the early days now, how did you both get involved in music in the first place?
Dan - My father was a radio DJ and so my house was full of 45s, music was always on (LOUD) and it was only when I became a teenager that I discovered it’s not the single most important thing in the world to everyone. I saw Chuck Berry perform in 1989 in my hometown of Wolverhampton, he lit a fire within me that will burn until I die.
Max - I started playing the instrument at a young age after seeing it at an American Folk festival near Chicago. Initially studying the American tradition of American folk, Celtic, Irish, Gaelic, and Northumbrian music, I started to branch out into other areas of study; eventually finding myself in Senegal - where I studied with the Cissoko family - and to India - where, after receiving a grant from the American Institute of Indian Studies, was able to study with the maestro Pandit Shivkumar Sharma. I think it is this unusual and varied background that helps give me my unique sound.
Do you come from musical families (apologies if you answered this in the question above)
Dan - My parents don’t play instruments, they are record people, fans of records.
Max - My family are great listeners of music and exposed me to a huge swath of styles of music. Growing up in Chicago, there was music everywhere we looked, and I’m deeply grateful for this exposure. Having the ability to listen, taste, see, and feel the arts from around the world is a blessing and breeds empathy and compassion; I hope we can all have this opportunity.
Are you both child prodigies or did you take to music later on in life?
Dan - Anyone that describes themselves as a child prodigy needs to sit down and have a coffee with themselves! We inherited an old pub’s upright and I played piano as a kid, I got a guitar when I was 12. I’ve always been frustrated with my musical ability and remain so on a bad day. But music has been the greatest release for me on so many occasions, songs have opened up this world, shown me layers of life and such beauty that transcends our everyday existence. The right combination of groove, chords, and words makes my heart melt and my head explode in a way I constantly yearn for.
Max - Ha! I wouldn’t call myself that, but I did start at the young age of seven.
Which band or artist made you want to get involved in music?
Dan - See above for the Chuck Berry reference. I was also remember a significant Red Lemon Electric Blues Band show at a similar time, and then Neil Young really took me on a journey some place else as a teenager.
Max - For me it was the hammered dulcimer that initially attracted me to music.
Looking back over your careers to date, what pitfalls would you advise people to look out for on their journeys?
Dan -
Mixing your own records can be a pitfall, cos you can lose your head inside the box (computer) so collaborate on that.
Share works in progress (with carefully chosen folks) this is akin to pouring light and air on the ideas, let them grow.
Don’t judge your own shit. Just record it/ archive it.
For all of their magic powers and incredible efficiency, music tech also has the power to be a unknowingly controlling of your creative process. But it’s beautiful if used creatively. I like imagining the ideas are their own life force, and they know all the answers. Trust the ideas, trust your inspiration.
I would encourage folks to improvise, perform, cut loose, embrace your imperfections.
Max -
Ha! Oh… so many to choose from….ok…
Work on your ego. Do ACTIVE work on your ego. Not passive “I hope to be a better person” type of stuff…no. ACTIVE work on losing your own biggest roadblock.
Don’t worry at all about what other people think. Create your art. Period. Easier said than done of course, but outside judgement is a killer, unnecessary, and rarely serves a positive purpose. I’m not saying that one must always be happy with what one creates. Be your harshest critic. Be fluent in your craft, but recognize that every person’s art is completely subjective and you must focus on the intention behind why you are making your art. If it is coming from a true and authentic place, then you really can’t go wrong. At that point there is no such thing as wrong.
You’re playing 6 live dates in November;
Wednesday 24th – International Anthony Burgess Foundation Manchester
Thursday 25th - Royal Birmingham Conservatoire
Friday 26th - The Sound Lounge, Sutton
Sunday 28th Ashburton Arts Centre South Devon
Monday 29th Glass Studio St George’s Bristol
Tuesday 30th The Plough Arts Centre @ St Anne's Barnstaple North Devon
What are you most looking forward to on the tour?
Dan - Introducing Max to beans on toast (he claims he doesn't like it!)
Max - I’m really looking forward to the show in Birmingham as (I believe) I have a workshop with the students there to discuss Indian Classical Music. I can’t wait to share!
Max’s soon to be favourite UK delicacy!
What do you LOVE about being on the road and touring?
Dan - The audiences, the heat of the performance time and the connection with people, I like hearing how folks interpret the words I write and sing
Max - The connection with people. If you take a big zoom-out-type look at life, we’re really these tiny little creatures walking about bumping into other tiny little creatures. What does one really do in life at that point? The most fundamental thing we do is connect with others. This is what it’s all about, and to be able to interact with those outside my normal experience of life is incredible. To be exposed to the cultures, to share on a nightly basis, to offer an honest look into myself…I love it.
And what do you HATE about it?
Dan - Sometimes I hate driving/travelling and poor quality beds in hotels
Max - How much time do you have?
Do you tend to find that you get a different reaction from the audience depending on where and when you perform?
Dan - Every night is entirely different if your eyes and ears are open.
Max - I have actually found the audience in the UK to be some of the best I’ve ever experienced. Their hunger for music is incredible and this excitement is contagious.
Max, the UK is far different from the US, what will you miss about being away from home during the tour? (you can buy American candy bars in most English supermarkets now so if you’re craving a packet of Mike & Ike’s or dying for a Peanut Butter Cup, you should be in luck!
Max - Haha, oh, nothing along those lines. I’ll miss my wife. Especially after these two years of being together each and every day, being away now will have its downsides. My wife is also a musician, so being together for long stretches is quite rare/has never happened.
Dan, tell me about your ‘Dreamland Tomorrow’ LP, where and when was it recorded? (If it was recorded during lockdown, do you think it would have sounded different had we NOT been under lockdown conditions?)
Dan - Dreamland Tomorrow is a double album. I recorded it in a number of different locations between 2017-2019 and it came out in May 2020 – so it's a pre lockdown baby. Much of disc one began at my own studio in Dudley, West Midlands, UK with a series of field recordings of bird song – I chose some of the calls to interpret on guitar and then used these riffs as the basis of lengthy jam sessions with my band.
I also recorded at RML Studios with the amazing Ryan Pinson in Wolverhampton, Richard Birkin in Derbyshire, Mark Freegard in Glasgow and Chris Pepper in Cambridgeshire. Dreamland (disc one) was produced by Tom Rose, snd mixed by John Elliott of The Little Unsaid.
The producer of Dreamland, Tom Rose, set me the task of writing and instrumental record – something I’d never done before, having previously always began the process with lyrics. This turned out to be a really effective challenge and I really enjoyed working in this way.
Disc Two is a live performance, produced by Boo Hewerdine and recorded/mixed by Jon Kelly at TileYard London, its closer to what I do when I play solo shows.
You have a number of albums under your belt now Dan, have you found that your style has remained static throughout the journey or has it changed/evolved over time? If so, what factors have caused this?
Dan - I hope my music is always evolving, naturally at it’s own pace. I try to tune into it and listen to where it is going. I follow rather than lead. We are made of water and forever flowing.
Thank you for your question about what factors have caused this. My answer is everything. I think it all goes into the melting pot and then songs emerge like splutterings from the bubbling mixture. When I say everything I mean conversations you have, a kiss on your neck, a loved one’s breath, the taste of your favourite drink, the skin on the hand of your son, the recording of Neil Young’s after the goldrush album, the production on the new Dawuna record, the poetry she writes, the photos he sends, it all goes in.
Max, when will your forthcoming debut solo album ‘Daybreak’ be available to purchase and will you be playing many tracks from it on the UK tour?
Max - I am so excited for this album. It will be released on April 1st, 2022 on Six Degrees Records out of San Francisco. The whole album is solo hammered dulcimer - one take, improvised, and without any additional layers - so I won’t be able to fully recreate what is on the album. That said, the intention and feeling that I put into the recording should be able to be recreated in front of an audience. I hope :)
Your joint EP ‘Ten Steps’ will only be available at your live shows, will it eventually be available to buy online?
Dan - No it’s only at the shows. This tour is a one off.
Max - We will be turning the EP into a full length in 2022 and will ship it to labels at that point for an eventual digital and physical release. In the meantime, you’ll only be able to purchase the EP from us on the tour.
Dan, have you already been to the US to tour with Max on his turf? If so, please tell me about it, if not, are you planning on doing so and when?
Dan - Still waiting on my invitation…Max?
There are TRILLIONS of bands and acts out there, please tell me about a few that you are currently enjoying….
Dan -
House of Waters are pretty decent
Dawuna (Glass Lit Dream)
Max -
Oh man. Nowadays the amount of quality music is unending. Here are a few albums that I am really loving these days:
Pharaoh Sanders/Floating Points - Promises
Run the Jewels - RTJ4
Manu Delago - Circadian
Sufjan Stevens - Carrie and Lowell
I’d like to thank both Max and Dan for sparing the time to chat to me, we’re really exited about the tour and if you’ve never seen them before, I urge you to free up your calendars and get down to a show, you really are in for a treat!
Tickets are available NOW from www.dan-whitehouse.com (selling FAST so get in there early to reserve yours).
